Enhancing the Employment Experience – Onboarding and Retention – With Guest Dr. Aliaa Remtilla | HR 70

Hi, welcome to the podcast HR inside out. I'm your

host Susan day and I am absolutely thrilled to welcome

Dr. Alia REM Tila to today's podcast.

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: Hi. It's great to be here with you.

Thanks for having me.

And thank you so much for saying yes. Now first a

little bit about you know, Dr. Alia Rotella is an

anthropologist and a filmmaker whose mission is to improve

understandings of the human experience. originally trained

as a filmmaker at Harvard University, Alia it takes

complex ideas and communicates them to the general public

through emotive storytelling in the visual medium. Allie is also

a professional researcher with an MA and a PhD in Social

Anthropology from the University of Manchester in the UK. She's

worked as a researcher at both the Institute of Ismaili Studies

in the UK, and at Simon Fraser University here in Canada.

Together she has conducted research in over 20 countries

including Afghanistan, Pakistan, Portugal, 10, chica Stan, and

Tanzania, examining the confluence of religion,

economics and politics. Alia has also served extensively with the

she Ismaili Muslim community through the Agha Khan councils

in Australia, New Zealand and in the United States of America.

Alia is skilled at shaping the strategic direction of community

organizations at all levels. For example, at a grassroots level,

supporting youth to navigate their Muslim identity while

living in a western context. at an institutional level,

establishing strategic partnerships with government and

civic entities. Ellie is currently the Chief Scientist

and the co founder of storytelling, a platform that

uses anthropology and tech to bring more authenticity to

workplace relationships. Love it by offering a simple automated

way to create impactful, personalized films to show

employees that they matter. Specifically for new graduate

hires, storytelling reduces the risk of reneges and it speeds up

the time to productivity with automated and personalized what

Aaliyah calls keep warm videos. Elena has actually recently

posted a YouTube video titled Gen Zed engagement, beyond

myths, the HR innovation, where she very nicely explains how

these videos and narratives work, and how they can enhance a

number of organizational initiatives, not only for Gen

Zed, but for all other generations of our work

colleagues, employment experiences. God love that. Oh,

yeah, I love that you started with a personal passion to be

different. And that sure caught my attention. There's got to be

a story there. Can we can I get you to jump in? With a little

bit about

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: you? Yeah, I mean, it's interesting, because

as you described my background, you know, we talked about dei

EDI, all of this and there's a lot of that in who I am, right?

You know, we're talking about me being Muslim working with Muslim

communities and actually 911 took place the night before my

first day of classes at Harvard was a very interesting, you

know, like, and then I'm physically, I mean, our

listeners can't can't hear that as can see me, but I have brown

skin, I'm of Indian origin. But I was born and raised in

Vancouver. And for me, it was how can I just be Canadian? And

it felt like you know, growing up well, I visibly was not what

the you know, external, potentially general perception

of what a Canadian might be, which did not include being

Muslim and having brown skin. So I think that was part of, of

just being different to begin with, outside of any choice of

my own. And then also, I was female, and I was a massive

hockey fan. And this is another way that we talked about being

underrepresented and this is changing today with PW HL but at

the time well, like if I wanted to be a professional hockey

player, was that even possible as a woman, you know, and what

it led to was this process of self discovery where this is, I

guess, the story of at one point, going from wearing my

female cousins hand me downs to my male cousins hand me downs,

cutting my hair off into a boycott and saying, Well, you

know, what, if to be my dream of being a professional hockey

player, I need to be a man. Well, let me start dressing like

one right and I remember the sort of pride and ROI of, you

know, skateboarding after my parents on a bicycle, who were

driving away on a bike their bicycles, and having someone

chase after them and telling them your son is trying to catch

you. And it this wasn't a gender exploration it was, how can I be

what I need to be in order to achieve what I want to achieve,

because I didn't see people like me doing the things that I

wanted to do. And as I went through this journey, I think

part of what I realized was that, you know, I mean, he went

back to wearing clothes that are traditionally defined as being

female, I grew my hair out. But that these very things that may

need different could actually become assets. And I could lean

into the difference instead of trying to cut the hair off and

change my clothes to the norm, if that makes sense. And so it

was very much a journey of, of how do I, if I'm going to be

different, do something with that difference that, you know,

can be what I need it to be even as to still enable me to go in

the places that I want it to go. And I think that this is very

much the journey of authenticity, right? And, you

know, preteen, it's it's quite different from that journey as

an adult. But I think it's very, like the having gone through

that experience as a child is very formative in how I continue

today, to really want to value authenticity in all aspects of

our lives, and create spaces where difference really can be

embraced.

I love that. And you know, it's vulnerability, right?

But I love that you modeled it, because when we model it, we

make it easier for others to to follow suit. You talk a lot

about the power of authenticity and the work that you do. And

with regard to this podcast, specifically and employee

onboarding, can, can we start there? And just what have you

learned from your research? With specific regard to the

onboarding experience? Let's start there. Yeah,

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: I mean, there's, there's a real problem

here, right? I was shocked when I learned 20% of new hires will

quit their job in their first 45 days on the job. Oh, really

high, right? That's like one in five people. Some people don't

even show up on day one. So this is like that Rena egg rate that

we were you're talking about, right. And I think it gets

worse, especially in the early career space, or potentially, in

some context, there's like up to an eight month gap between job

offer and start date. So it becomes hard to keep that

interest. And that's where I talk about keep warm. I think

that that the challenge that we face in HR is that there's so

much practical stuff we have to deal with. Right? There's the

paperwork, compliance, like, and then there are legal

restrictions, I think it's California, where you like,

there's certain things that you can and cannot do with someone

before they get there, like officially on payroll, right,

like so there's, there's even legally a limitation on how much

engagement we can do. And essentially, I think with all of

this, what gets lost is the stuff that matters most to the

new hire. And I think if I'm starting a new job, that's as

much as the social aspects of things that I'm really, really

keen to figure out, you know, who's going to be the people

that I'm going to be working with? Am I going to like them

like a boss? Are they gonna like me? Are we going to have, you

know, stuff to relate about relate together around. And I

think that this the social emotional connection to

colleagues, managers, direct reports, and a company right to

feel like this is a company I'm excited to be working for. I

think that's the stuff that really, really matters. And that

sometimes right now is falling through the cracks.

I've certainly seen, not so much the people quitting

in that short timeframe that you've expressed and supported

by the research but where there are lag between offering and

somebody's first start date, especially if you're hiring from

outside the country. And you're right, all the paperwork and

stuff that's that's involved. of, yeah, people accepting

something else in the interim, and not showing up. And which is

really tough, not only on the organization in general, but on

the colleagues that are waiting for, you know, help with with

the work that that individual is going to help with. Totally. I

want to take us actually, as we talk about this to a research

article that you referenced on your website, it was titled,

breaking the manor eliciting their best reframing

socialization around newcomers have authentic self expression.

And in that article, I learned that companies that emphasize

personal identity during the onboarding process experience a

250% increase in employee retention after just seven

months, given the cost of losing an employee, which, you know,

you can use up to sometimes two or three times their annual

salary. That's a pretty exciting statistic. What are you finding

in the other research that you've, you've been doing? Oh,

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: it's so good that you bring this up. And

especially because I think it's bringing together everything

we've discussed so far, right? So from everything from my own,

need to figure out in my own personal journey, who I am, and

find that authenticity. And I think that's connecting my own

personal journey to what we were just discussing in terms of new

hire, onboarding, and, and creating space for authenticity

in the workplace. And I think that this the need for for

individuals in the work context, to feel that they have a place

to be themselves, emphasize that personal identity, and have that

be connected to employee retention. Almost seems logical,

right? Once you think about all of that, and, and I think so if

you're asking about the other research, I think McKinsey did a

study in 2021, and said that exactly like this, this lack of

connection and appreciation is the number one driver for

attrition for people quitting, and people are three times more

likely to quit, because they don't feel like they belong at

work, then because they feel like they're poorly compensated.

And that's crazy, right? Because whenever we think about

retention, we think about, Okay, how are we going to increase

salary packages? How are we going to, you know, give them

more incentives? And we think practically, we think about,

like, you know, oh, let's, let's give them more gift cards, let's

give them this. But actually, sometimes, all they need is to

feel socially connected. And, you know, this is becoming so

much worse, with remote and hybrid work. So I think that

this, this, it becomes harder, right? Like, it's, if you're

connecting over the water cooler, or you just happen to

have to say hi to someone when you're coming into an office

that facilitates the sort of informal connection, and you

almost don't need a formalized program to resolve it. But yeah,

this is a problem. I think another stat at 57% of employees

are feeling invisible at work right now. It's high, right? If

if you're feeling invisible, you don't feel connected, and you

don't feel like you have your personal identity being seen.

It is absolutely critical. And something that I

certainly have worried about with this one thing with this a

hybrid work environment where individuals at least come in,

you know, to be working with their colleagues in person

periodically. But for those who are working completely remotely,

that's always been a concern of mine from a from a caring about

people perspective. Yeah. Is that

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: sorry, go ahead and done it. You know,

that this that to the point of of the hybrid, I think there are

different ways of doing hybrid. And I think that like, there's

also a question within hybrid of whether folks are coming in on

the same days, because in the type of hybrid where you know,

you pick your days, then you may still not be getting that

connection, if the like if there is no one to connect with on the

days that you're there.

Good point. Good point. Now, that for our

listeners, it's like, yeah, Susan, guy, like, we know about

all of that. But what can we be doing differently? And that's

what's so exciting about when you were telling me about your

business storytelling, where you've talked about how

storytelling can be used as a follow up to the recruitment

process, please? Yes, yes, there is a tool list. Over to you

please to share a little bit about storytelling and how it's

used in the recruitment process.

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: Yeah. So I mean, I think so much of what

we've been discussing right now is the importance of creating

human connection and then starting off on that foot. And

that's what we're doing with storytelling is we're trying to

say, okay, even if you're working in person, and it's

fully in person work context, before the first day, everyone's

remote, because the new hire is not coming in, right? So in that

fully remote, pre boarding time, like the pre day, one time, we

facilitate a way to actually start the creation of those

social connections. And we do that through I mean, I guess the

fancy word would be asynchronous video, but essentially what we

do our tech makes it smooth. For easy and quick to collect videos

from different videos like personalized video recordings

from different individuals, and then auto edit them together

into a beautiful gift for the new hire now, we realize this.

So essentially, let's start like, what would this look like?

Let's say that we've hired someone there starting in one

week, two weeks, and we want to give them this amazing warm

welcome and start as quickly as possible. The creation of the

relationships between that individual and our future team.

What we enable companies to do is to say, okay, that feature

team, let's have them all, send a video message, introduce

themselves, tell them a little bit about why they're excited

for the new hire to work with them and to start, and we

collect those videos. First of all, we make it super easy for

everyone to record those videos, we know that most of us are not

in Gen Zed, we don't know how to record a video, and it feels

super awkward. So we've designed a product that has pre written

scripts teleprompters, making it like just dummy proof, remove

all the stress from the process. And then we integrate with HR I

SS ATS is to smooth out that whole administrative part of

things. And then once the videos are collected, we enhance them

with music, company branding, title cards, edited it all

together into this gorgeous website that includes a list of

all of the people on the team and their photos. So that that

new hire, basically before they even starts is just like, wowed

by the fact that they are they're like wait, really, that

these folks took the time to send me this amazing custom

video just for me. And what ends up happening is they show up on

day one, and they already kind of know everyone a little bit,

right. So you just speed up that entire process of building those

relationships, which the data tells us our key to retention.

And this all gets done before day one, and it takes like two

minutes from each person, which is way quicker than the 30

minute coffee chat that you would otherwise have to schedule

after they start. So it's a massive time saver for everyone

involved. And it wow was the new hire to set off in a really

great start. And yeah, it's, it's really excited about it.

Wow, I can't even imagine how wonderful that would

feel. And I know when we talked, you know, you also the

encouragement about a little bit something about personal about,

you know, the fact that you are a dog lover, or you know,

something that you know, sometimes in the busyness of our

work, especially when we don't have those water cooler

conversations, it's really hard to get to know your work

colleagues. So that would be such it's such an incredible

gift. And that's not withstanding that those 30

minute coffee conversations afterwards are still incredibly

important. But what a marvelous gift. I know that you also have

used storytelling or not you but the organization's for

recognizing individuals, or groups of individuals with

personalized films such as what you've just described, perhaps

to recognize a milestone like a project that's been completed

and boy, putting in hrs new systems that deserved at least

that. Can you provide an example from the work that you do,

actually telling us a little bit about an organization not

necessarily identifying who they are, but how that application of

storytelling has been used? Yeah.

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: So we have a number of different I mean, I

think that the, the way I see it is you essentially have three

phases in which you can use storytelling. So the first that

is in the recruitment process, so the ability to use our videos

for testimonials that can be embedded in Job, Job, adverts

information about the company that gets crowdsource things

like that. So that's in the recruiting process. I've also

seen storytelling used for immediate follow ups. So if you

want to send like a company branded, you know, with the auto

editing that we have to offer a quick follow up after an

interview with a stellar candidate, especially like let's

say you're going to a job fair. This is like in the early career

space. I've seen this a lot where there is massive

competition for the top 10 candidates and every company

wants that candidate. following it up with an that one of our

storytelling edited video saying we love talking to you. And this

is why in a video that has your company branding is pretty cool.

Oh yeah, definitely a way to company apart. So that's the

first bit in the recruiting context, I think the second is

what we've talked about so far in terms of the pre day one. So

post job offer pre day one. And I'll come back to that, because

I think there's some good examples there. And then the

third is in the ongoing engagement. So that's where

they're what you were talking about just now with work

anniversaries, birthdays, I've seen a lot of really good uses

around personal milestone vacations. So having a new baby

getting married, getting citizenship, or getting your

permanent residency milestones that are really big, right,

like, that's huge and a person's life, and recognizing it in a

way that shows real real value, I think there's a certain

category of employee that's earning a lot of money already,

where a $50 gift card or $100 gift card, I mean, really, and

then in Canada, there's an additional tax burden on the

gift, you're essentially getting them to pay more out of pocket

to get something they may not even want. Whereas this type of

gift is the gift that just you know, it's it's emotionally

valuable. So you can even place $1 value on it. There for that

middle type of category there, the pre boarding before day one,

I've seen two different types of companies really lean into this

that have a specific need. One is in a context of really high

high frequency turnover, high volume of hires, customer

service matters in the space, right, like, if you're talking

about retail, you need that new hire to be really excited to get

going. So wowing them before day one makes a big difference. And

because turnover is so frequent, you kinda want to do every

little extra bit that you can, with out paying them a ton more,

because that's actually, you know, probably go against what's

best for the company. So that's where a video helps. And then

the second is, is that that sort of grayed hierarchy form problem

that we were talking about. So I think those are two of the like,

niches that I've seen, multiple companies really, really need

it. And then of course, the other type of company that tends

to really gravitate towards using storytelling are your

cultural leaders. So companies that are performing really well

on already creating a great work environment, they tend to be

early adopters of any new technology that is arising to

make things even better for further employers or their

employees. So I think those are maybe three different categories

of companies that use us,

as I was listening to, I was just thinking of a

situation where somebody was just being honored with their 20

years with the company. And their boss took the time to

basically list out in an email, every accomplishment that you

know, every promotion that that individual had experienced

through their career with the organization, and how much that

meant. And I can't even imagine how that would be just made so

much, even more impactful if it had been the video with the boss

talking about those and just, you know, again, just so much

more personal. Yeah, well, I could see this would be huge,

and making a really significant difference. For anybody. I can't

imagine anyone not being Oh, just blown away by receiving a

storytime.

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: Absolutely. And you know, it never gets old.

Like, every time it can be the exact same thing over and over.

And as a giver, you're like, Oh, this is going to be boring. It's

going to be the same thing again, for the recipient never.

It's, they just keep them coming. Right. And it is it's in

the nonverbal you're right that there's something very very

unique about video. It's it's the the facial expressions, and

you know, the things that aren't spoken but are seen. That

indicates a lot.

Well, it's that authenticity that comes through.

So I know when we were talking and I'm thinking oh my goodness,

this would be very expensive. And I worked primarily in

nonprofit and public sector through my career. And there was

very little money If that, you know, unfortunately was able to

be budgeted for these kinds of initiatives, what can an

organization expect? Working with you and your colleagues? If

they're interested in using storytelling and in their

recruitment retention? Initiatives? What kind of costs?

How would it work? ballpark?

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: Yeah, great question. I'll start by saying

that there's a lot of personalization. So we're not

one of you know, we believe in in the value of authenticity,

and we work really directly with our company. So what can you

expect you can expect to have a call with me directly? And, you

know, not just with some sort of salesperson who's trying to turn

out monthly quotas, so and that personalization goes to pricing

as well. So we work with companies based on how we can

for us, it's it's a question of how can we have impact on that

company? I think in terms of like the formally listed prices,

packages still are very cheap. So ballpark, starting as low

from as $300 a month, Canadian dollars. So but but you know,

we're always really keen to explore new use cases. And our

our vision is to improve authenticity and that human

relationship in as many workplaces as possible. So we're

really keen to work with companies to design solutions

that match their specific budgets, we never want pricing

to be a bet barrier.

You did mention per month? Yeah. Oh, is that

something that you need to sign a contract that it's specific

months? Or again, you really work with the client and find

out? What would work for that client? That sounds like you're

pretty flexible. But yes.

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: The landline? Should we just let it

ring and make a note to just delete this? Yeah. off, wait for

it to finish ringing? Forget they my parents set up a

landline. Okay. Do you want to repeat the question? Or do you

share that?

You mentioned that it's a per month cost. So, but

you've also talked about being really flexible with regard to

an organization's specific needs. So I'm assuming you would

be flexible, but perhaps you could speak to that? Yeah,

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: for sure. So there are there are companies

that want to pay just for one video. And that's always a

possibility, we find that the majority of use cases are

actually repeat use cases where companies want to do you know,

let's say a video for every new hire, and hiring is ongoing. So

it works out more economically friendly to our customers to

just sort of do a one off set up and then have a monthly

subscription, that just sort of enables them to keep using the

product and use the software as as much as they want. And so

that's why we've gone to instead of buying a package of a certain

number of videos to actually say, You know what, let's solve

solve the issue, just keep using it. Once we've done the setup

and the customization. Just just just pay and we actually don't

charge for the setup and customization. So our general

approach is to have a monthly subscription paid annually. And

that enables us to sort of invest in that upfront cost to

customize algorithm for that company with their branding.

And, you know, all the video editing algorithms, all the

integrations with ATS as hrs is all of that stuff that enables

it to be really seamless. And by the way, it's really quick,

right? So if a company decides to use it today, I mean, within

a day or two, they're they're off and running like it's yeah,

it's really not heavy on the setup. But yeah, to your point,

if if that type of pricing is a major barrier, we can we can

discuss other things I just I haven't seen for the use cases

that I think we thrive on that seems to be the best pricing

model at this stage.

Okay, what I'm hearing you say is that call me?

Oh, wait, let's leave it at that. As we bring this podcast

to a close, is there anything that I haven't thought to ask

you that our listeners might find helpful regarding this

very, very important topic?

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: You know? I just don't think anything beats

face to face interaction. Like we're talking about

authenticity, we're talking about creating real

relationships. We're talking about the the need For, you

know, creating space for personal identity in the

workplace, I'd love it if we were put out of business because

every single person in the office actually took the time

out individually, to have those real face to face conversations

to, to take the time to develop those real human relationships

in their workplace. I also realized this is impractical,

which is why we exist. I know that it takes a lot of time to

do that, I know that we are in a world where we're remote is here

to stay. And I know that that companies grow, right, so what

may be possible for a smaller company for a smaller team. As

you know, I remember talking to this one company where the CEO

personally cooks a barbecue lunch for his team once a

quarter. And, you know, you can't like don't replace that

with a storytelling video. But I also we were talking why because

the company was getting too large for it to be feasible for

the CEO to cook that up that much. But you know, for Yeah, so

I think it's essentially that's that would be my my sort of

final point, I think, like at that point where it becomes too

difficult to do, at that sort of individual level. Reach out this

is this is, you know, if you're recognizing the problem, need

help solving it. And even if you don't know that storytelling is

right for you, that's fine. I'm always happy to chat, discuss

options, I have been working in this space for a while, I've

been doing a lot of research in this space. And ultimately, I

want to be helping companies foster stronger and authentic,

more authentic human connections amongst their employees in any

way possible. So really, really happy to connect with folks who

who are, you know, exploring this for their own companies.

It really is the core of who you are. And it's

interesting, because, you know, even if companies were to use it

for those key positions that, you know, tend to go through a

number of interview processes. And I'm just, I could see even

through those interview processes of using this from and

I think you and I talked about, with the recruiters, you know,

because often there are multiperson recruitment teams,

saying a little bit about who they are, you know, or just

encouraging someone along the process so that you don't end up

losing good candidates, I could see a whole bunch of different

uses. And that brings me to you also have been very interested

in in. And I think you talked about it in the giveth and nudge

YouTube video, keeping family stories alive. So before we

before we come to a close, little bit about that I think

your grandma was was What took you on that journey? Yeah,

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: I think so. My grandma turned 90, nearly 10

years ago. She's turning 99 This year, and she's still with us.

Oh, yes, amazing. And for her 90th birthday, we wrote a book

about her life. And it was not the most fun to put that book

together because the technology wasn't great. And, you know, my,

we tried to solve that problem, actually, by, you know, we're

pretty good at helping people open up a video for them. And we

we built a tech product that enabled families to capture

their life stories we actually are about to have. We've

submitted, we had a university in Australia, the University of

Canberra, who worked together with an aged care facility to

assess the efficacy of that tech product that we built in

improving the quality of dementia care by having the

caregivers talk to the dementia of the folks with dementia and

capture their stories with their tech in video form. And so

hopefully that publication will come out soon to valid and it

does that the publication that we that the paper that we wrote

does validate the efficacy that our tech is very good at doing

this. So yeah, it's something that's a bit of a side project

for us and you know, something that we yeah, we really care

about in terms of this, this mission to capture stories and I

think it goes back to honestly where we started right, which is

about our identity and about creating I think that if if we

want to build communities, that and and future leaders really

that are confident in the entirety of who they are, with

all of the diversity that comes As with an all the diversity,

right, because there are many layers of different types of

diversity, a lot of that is feeling comfortable and rooted

in our stories and our heritage in our family traditions, in our

community traditions, however, community is defined in

understanding those legacies that we inherit and how they

have shaped us and come to be. So I think this is actually

quite critical. And I know, you know, yeah, on the side have

also written a book that specifically about my own

community, my the Ismaili, Muslims, her history from East

Africa, and this has also been part of that own journey for me

right as understanding my own heritage. So I think it's really

shaped so much of who I am. And I do believe that you know,

whether or not you're capturing it in a video forum, I think

that going home and talking to our parents and our grandparents

and our aunts and our uncles, and just, you know, asking the

questions beyond the mundane, you know, so not like, what did

you have for lunch today? But, you know, questions about your

childhood? What were your you know, what was school? Like for

you? What were some of the challenges that you've overcome,

and understanding that and, and being, when stories repeat

themselves, because that's part of the process, but only

continues to ask those questions and to learn? Again,

what a gift and a legacy individuals within

organizations? Yeah, wouldn't it be wonderful to capture those,

you know, as part of an organization's branding? Yeah,

you know, well, I can just see so many uses of storytelling,

and it's, it's so exciting what you're doing. And just, I so

appreciate the you're saying yes, to coming and sharing a

little bit about your journey, your personal journey, and the

work that you're doing with storytelling. And, and, and

others, like this book that you've just referenced, how do

people contact you, and I will put not only your contact

information, but also a link to the book, if that's okay. And to

some of the articles that that we've referenced in the show

notes to the podcast. So how do you how do people contact you?

Dr. Aliaa Remtilla: Yeah, reach out to me on LinkedIn, I'm

always on it. Always tricky messages. So me, I will respond.

Excellent. Thank you. And I do encourage that reach

out to at least learn a little bit more. I just, I think this

is just a phenomenal idea, and one that really could be helping

us with recruitment and retaining those employees within

our organizations. Thank you. Thank you for being here. And

making the time it is time for us to say goodbye. And for our

listeners. Thank you for connecting with us and

supporting HR inside out. Remember, dare to soar? Because

we believe you can. It is Elia and Susan signing out. Have a

great rest of your day everybody. Bye. Take care. Bye

bye