E 255: Boundaries, Forgiveness, and Healing After Dysfunction with Martha Burch

Well, hello, everybody, and welcome back to another episode of Adult Child of Dysfunction.

Today we have with us Martha Burch.

And she is.

Well, actually, she's done all kinds of interesting things.

She's worked with children.

She's been a child psychology professor.

She now volunteers in prisons to help addicts and alcoholics and.

And oh, my goodness, the list just goes on and on and on.

So I'm actually just going to welcome Martha and let her tell you a little bit about herself.

So.

So thank you so much for coming, Martha.

Thanks, Tammy.

And I'm so glad to be here.

And you know what?

The very first thing about me is I was an unwanted child, and that really colored my life a lot.

But why was I unwanted?

My father was a terrible alcoholic and gambler, and he gambled and drank all the money away.

So my, my mother already had two children, my two older brothers, a six year old and a one year old.

And then when she got pregnant with me, her first thought was, I can't feed the other two.

What am I going to do with this?

How am I going to help this one?

So I always had that feeling all my life that I was a burden.

You know, my mother loved me.

She was a good mother.

I went and start crying, but I definitely was a burden because she had so much on her mind and life was hard for her.

So that did definitely distort my beliefs and my feelings and how I grew up.

And it affected me a lot because most of my family was very social.

My.

My brothers were very social, my mother was very social, and I was always a loner.

So, you know, as we talk about things today at Adult Children of Dysfunction, you know, why was my dad an alcoholic?

Well, my father was a prisoner of war of the Germans for two years in World War II.

Now, I would think that that would affect his life somewhat.

So, you know, we can't really blame him.

But then again, people have come out of worse circumstances and not had their children starve and do other things.

So, you know, we also have to talk about forgiveness.

You know, there's so much in my background to unpack.

Right.

You know what, what's the point?

The point is the past doesn't equal the future if you don't let it.

And that's really something that we definitely want to talk about today, because whatever happened to you yesterday, today's a new day and we have to learn how to handle it and move on with our lives because people need us.

No matter what you think of yourself, somebody needs your experience, your knowledge Just your presence.

So you need to get over it.

Goodness, I'm really getting on it quick today.

You, I was gonna say you just jumped right in.

Yeah, get over it now, because otherwise people who need you are not going to be helped by you because you're too busy with your own ego.

And I'm going to bring up one more thing, Tammy.

People think that big ego means that you think too much of yourself.

No, it's the other way too.

You think too little of yourself.

You think you're worthless.

That's an ego problem, too, which we might get into more later.

So, you know, if you don't think you're good enough, you're wasting your time and everybody else's.

It's time for you to start thinking, how can I be useful in this world?

That means you're going to walk a dog, whatever.

You know, there are people who spend all their time with animals and they are doing wonderful work in the world.

There are people who spend all their time with insects, with birds, with whatever.

And you know what you have to determine where's your mercy?

Can you play guitar?

Can you play piano?

What do you do?

Do you draw?

Do you crochet?

Do you knit?

You have talents and skills that other people need and it's time to start stepping up to the plate and being useful.

Well, that's a very, very straight to the point and no, no holding back kind of, you know, that's.

And it's exactly right.

Not exactly how I would have put it, but it's exactly right.

You're, you're, you're totally right.

And I always say to people, people think, you know, well, when you take care of yourself or you go to therapy, like you don't deserve it.

Because people that grew up in that kind of thing, I mean, you said it yourself, you felt worthless, you felt unlovable, you felt like you were a burden.

So you're not stepping out in the world and you're not doing the things that you're capable of because you don't think, for one big picture, you don't think you deserve it.

And so a lot of people, you know, think, oh, self care, that's, that's selfish.

But I agree with you.

I always say the most selfless thing you can do is give the world the best of you.

Because if you're.

And if you're.

So if you're giving them this held back, timid, afraid, ego driven, which, like you said, is, Goes both ways, either thinking too much of yourself or too little of yourself, then you're not giving them.

And so you are doing people of disservice, unfortunately, again, you know, and that's why we're here on this podcast, is because so many people feel that way, but people don't know how to undo it.

It's not as simple as just get over it, you know, I mean, I know, and I know you know, you.

Know that you're right.

I'm not.

I'm not saying you said that, but I mean, just like those words, like, how do you do that?

So how do you do that?

I mean, when you were growing up, you said your mother loved you very much, but you felt like you were a burden.

Was there ever.

Did she ever verbally, like, did she treat you like you were just too much?

Or.

Or was it just that you knew in your.

In your mind?

Yeah, I just.

I just knew in my mind she never treated me like I was too much.

Her life was very stressful.

So, you know, no matter what she did, I think I. I always.

I always had that feeling that somehow I don't belong here.

And then I was, of course, insecurely attached, right?

So I remember Tammy at age 15, 15, my mother and I went shopping at a department store, and I lost her.

I started screaming in the middle of store, mom, Mommy.

Mommy.

Oh, she was so mad.

She was so mad at me.

I embarrassed her so much.

But that's how insecurely attached I was.

I just felt like I had to know where my mother was at all times.

And that's just some of the things that happen when you grow up and you don't feel and you're scared and.

You'Re scared, and it goes, you know, and it could go on the flip side, where at 15, I wanted nothing more than to get as far away from my mother as possible for the same, you know, for some of the same reasons, but different kind of attachment or disattachment situations, you know?

But so what are some things that you did?

Like, when did you realize, okay, this, you know, my past doesn't define me?

At what point did you.

You make such a good point.

It is a process, and sometimes it's a very slow process.

I started to see I had a therapist at age 15 because I knew something wasn't right, and we had to work on me saying hello to people.

I was so introverted and so afraid of people's opinions of me that I didn't even know how to say hello to people.

If someone smiled at me, it would make my day because I thought I was Just so useless and, and stupid and dumb and everything else.

None of which was true.

But that's what pretty much clouded my thoughts most of the time.

So we had to work on that.

And, you know, luckily I was real responsible.

So I did well in school, well enough.

And I had a job and I was very, you know, I went to my job every day and did my, did my work and I was responsible at work.

And so, you know, the therapist said, martha, I would put you in the hospital, but you go to school every day, you're doing good, and you have a job and you've had it for more than a year and you're doing well.

So we'll just work on things outside, you know, and that's pretty much what we did then.

Then, then it was, you know, always a process.

Then I went to college and, and, you know, I did get kicked out of two colleges and, But I, I went back.

So, you know, no matter what, how many times you failed, you got to get back up.

And that was my mother.

My, I was crying to my mother one day.

I said, how, what am I going to do?

I, I, I can't go back to school.

I've got a, I had a 1.0 GPA.

That's a D. I beat you.

I had a 1, 2, 3.

And I thought I was.

So I thought that was that I had a numerical like, streak.

Like, I wasn't a 1, 3, 4.

It was a 1, 2, 3.

Wow.

Wow.

Like, I'm the biggest loser in the world.

My life will always be terrible.

And my mother said, you know what?

You march right back to that college and you ask them to let you back in.

You tell them you're going to do right.

And I did.

I went back and the guy said, okay, yes, six months probation.

You better make a C and above on everything and change your ways.

And I did.

I grew up.

That was, that was a consequence that made, you know, helped me to grow up.

And that's why consequences are important, not punishment, consequences.

That's why reality.

You need to let children experience reality.

You know, it's part of my parenting method.

The three Ls of parenting.

Love them enough to say no.

People who don't accept no for an answer become very unpleasant human beings.

They also don't know how to say no to themselves.

So they become obese, drug addicts, alcoholics, just violent, unpleasant people who don't understand that other people have needs and wants.

And society can go much better if we follow certain rules anyway.

So love them enough to Say no.

Lead by example.

Stop telling them to behave one way when you're doing the opposite.

Don't smoke, don't drink.

Right.

So leave by example.

Do as I say, not as I do.

There you go.

How many times did I hear that.

You want to see in the world?

Oh, go ahead.

How many times?

Yeah, exactly.

And you know, my mother.

My mother was the example.

She was very responsible.

She didn't drink, she didn't smoke.

She.

She was a very, very lovely human being, and I was very fortunate to have her as a mother.

Anyway, let's go on.

So be the example you want to be in the world.

So stop talking about other people.

Don't do this and do that and blah, blah, blah.

No, you do what you need to do and don't worry about what they do.

You do the right thing.

All right?

So be the example and let them fail, for goodness sakes.

Let them go after the job that they're.

That.

That they're totally unprepared for.

Experience, the application process experience, you know, not getting the job.

And.

But when we.

When we don't let them fail, they become quitters.

And, you know, we all know the story.

Quitters never win.

Winners never quit.

If you really want something, you can't quit.

Go for the job.

That's way above you.

Okay, you're going to be rejected, possibly, but you may learn.

You probably, if you're smart, you'll learn a whole lot.

You'll learn a whole lot.

So get.

Get your eyes open.

Stop accepting what.

What you really don't want because you think that's all you can get.

That's what happens when people marry people that they really aren't that interested in, but they think it the best they could get.

People take jobs that they're totally overqualified for, but they think it's the best they can get, and then they're not happy and they don't do a good job, et cetera, et cetera.

So you know what?

Let your children fail and let them be disappointed and say, gosh, you know, that's tough.

What do you want to do about it?

I want you to recap.

Just give the three bullet points because it was.

Love your kids enough to say no.

What was the second one again for?

Just to refresh, to recap for people.

Exactly.

Lead by example.

Lead by example.

Okay.

And let them fail.

And yourself.

You know what?

You got to go out there and fail, ask people for stuff, and hear, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Until, you know, a lot of times people are so afraid to hear the word no.

So then reverse it.

Why don't you do an experiment?

Start going up to people and saying, will you give me a dollar?

Will you this?

Will you that?

Just see what happens.

The average is, it's.

Out of 10 asks, you get nine no's.

Well then on the 10th one, somebody will say yes to something.

Or you know, just ask, ask your kids to do stuff.

Do pick up your.

And you know, so just do an experiment.

Don't make it about you.

It's just about, oh, it's what works.

What doesn't work.

We make too much about us.

We're so darn defensive about everything.

And let's just.

I'm going to get into this real quick, you know, as parents and what we're.

As parents, as people, whenever someone criticizes us, we get ourselves all bent out of shape and we try to defend ourselves.

It's a waste of time.

You know, what if somebody criticizes you, say, well, that's very interesting.

Or why do you say that?

Right.

Then you can get some information.

Don't be defensive.

Nobody wants to hear your defensiveness.

They don't even care.

Right.

They just want you to do go.

Oh, no, no, no, go ahead.

They want you to do the right thing, do it right, whatever.

Right.

And hear themselves talk.

So you have to accept that too.

Yep.

And that just goes back to again, I mean, we're talking about adult children of dysfunction who came in with that.

So they're defensive because they're.

Sometimes it's safety, sometimes it's self esteem.

You know, sometimes saying no was not the right thing to do ever.

You know, I mean, when we talk about, when you're talking about, you know, love your kids enough to say no and giving them boundaries and letting them fail.

And that's about boundaries.

And you know, that's.

Some kids are.

And adults are petrified of that.

That's where I start with a lot of the people that I talk to is just like you said, test the waters.

I always tell people to go into a restaurant and order something that's not on the menu.

And if they say no, they say no.

And then you just have to think about it.

Did that kill me?

No, it didn't kill me.

It wasn't the end of the world.

Because you can't start with these big boundaries and big picture things.

When they're big scale, you have to start.

You have to start and practice little by little baby steps.

So I love that.

Exactly.

And you know, I gave a talk at a women's Expo.

And it was how to say no.

And, you know, a couple of women came up to me afterwards, and one of them said, it was 50 years old, she had children and everything.

She said, I've never said no in my life.

What?

And her life was miserable.

She was miserable.

She said, I'm afraid to say no.

I mean, it was very.

It was very eye opening.

Yes, that's exactly what we do.

We put ourselves in a prison, and we're constantly trying to meet other people's expectations.

And, you know, news flash, you will never meet someone's expectations completely.

Never, never, never.

Just get over it, people.

There's, you know, it, It's.

It never ends.

I. I like to say, you know what?

There's always something else I have to do.

Okay.

I just washed the dishes.

Yeah, but now I'm going to cook and there's going to be more dishes.

It's never over.

There's never an ending.

You know, I wrote one book.

Okay, great.

Now I still have another book to write, but now I have this book, and now it's time to promote it.

So all the time it's another podcast, it's another article.

It's something.

No, it's never, you know, I'm never the.

You're never at the top of the mountain, right?

It's constant climbing, climbing, climbing.

And even if you are at the top, there's still a whole lot more to do because then you got to start walking down, don't you?

You can't just stay there.

Life won't, you know, you'll.

You'll die.

You.

You have to.

You have to keep moving.

So, yes, there's always something else that has to be done, and we need to, you know, as human beings.

Duh.

Okay, just stop whining and just do it.

Just do it.

Okay.

Yes.

It aggravates me.

Darn.

You know, I. I can't believe I have to do this again.

And whatever, whatever, just.

Just move on.

And if you do the right thing today, tomorrow takes care of itself.

So just do what you can do today.

Don't get overwhelmed about tomorrow or what you did yesterday.

Just do what you can do today.

I, I say that all the time.

Just stay in the present.

Because, like, people that are anxious or have anxiety or depression or whatever, it's like half of it is worrying about something that happened, you know, worrying about, right.

What's going to happen because of something that happened in the past which you can't change, you can't do anything about.

And then the other half is anticipatory fear, anger, anxiety about something that's going to happen in the future.

And again, you can't, it's probably not going to.

So I just stay right here and make the decisions and think about the things that you can change and you can control.

And that is a lot of, like you said, is a lot of boundaries.

Now, you worked with, you said you work, volunteer in the prison system, right?

Yeah, and that's, that's.

And you know, and here's the thing about that, all right, I, I always say I taught high school.

I, I ain't afraid of nothing.

Nobody scares me.

And that's one reason I went into the prison because I thought, you know what?

Nobody else has a lot of.

Most other people don't have the experience I have because if you teach high school, you won't believe what you go through and what you deal with a lot of times.

So I thought, you know what, I'm the person to go because I know the communication techniques, which is a lot of what I talk about in the book.

The book talks about that, how to communicate.

And just as an aside, you know, the book is five star rated.

Yes, you can raise happy, responsible children on Amazon.

And everyone who's read it has told me how it has helped them, not just with their children, but with adults, with their parents, with all kinds of people.

So it has, it really resonates.

And the information in that book is what helped me handle my students and to deal with the people in the jail and usually in the jail there's a lot of ego, ego needing A lot of people need somebody to say something positive.

Right.

I'm going to pause for just one second.

Okay, so we're back.

Took a little break there, but yeah, so, so continue on where you were talking about being in the prison.

Yeah, so, so the prison is a really interesting, a very interesting place because people come for all kinds of different reasons.

And I've met some really interesting women there.

But, you know, let me tell you about one.

She's been released since.

In fact, I was very fortunate.

I was able to have a lot of success in the prison.

When the women got out, they stayed sober, drug free, and they went on to, you know, lead really positive lives.

I have one woman, she was a meth addict and when she was in prison, she was pregnant.

And so she said the minute she found out she was pregnant, she stopped taking all drugs.

But then one day we were in, we were in our meeting and she was about, I don't know, five or six Months pregnant.

And everybody was talking to her about how, oh my goodness, you're not going to get any sleep when that baby comes, blah, blah, blah.

And she said, just as innocently as anything, Tammy, she said, yes, I know, that's why I'm going to have to go back on meth.

I can laugh about it, but most people are like, what?

What?

But she really had that mindset.

Well, of course, you know, all the other ladies in the jail said, oh, let's talk about this then.

Anyway, so she came out and you know what was really interesting about?

Just after she was released, her mother died.

A month later, her father died.

She stayed sober and drug free through all of it.

Then, okay, so she had the first baby and she's an absolutely fabulous mother.

And then now she's just had a second baby and just her family is so absolutely wonderful.

You know, she was a woman filled with strength and skills and abilities.

But of course, like too many of us, we never realize that because nobody tells us something positive.

They always tell us what we do wrong.

So, you know, that's just one of my positive stories.

I had another woman, they were going to take her children away.

And every time her mother had her children while she was in jail, and every time she called her mother, they would argue.

So I told her, I said, you know what, you need to just listen.

Don't defend yourself.

Just listen to what your mother has to say.

You don't have to agree nothing.

Just listen.

And she told me, like within a month, she said, oh, my goodness, our relationship has totally changed.

And then two or three months later, she said, they're not going to take my children away anymore.

They said, I've changed.

Then she got out and she's a whole different human being.

She's been out at least a year now, and she's really, really doing well.

She has a job.

You know, just.

It's just these positive stories.

Yesterday does not equal tomorrow.

Exactly.

Today, tomorrow will work out.

And I try to tell people it doesn't matter how bad it seems, it can always get better.

But you have to surround yourself with the people that are going to help you make it better.

And you have to really look inside and stop looking for the outside people to make it better.

Because at the end of the day, you're the only one that can make those choices.

And I talk to people, especially, you know, I. I deal with a lot of people whose parents were alcoholics.

Mine.

Both of mine were alcoholics.

My mom was a drug addict.

And so, yeah, I came out with that, I can make the bad choice or I cannot.

You know, and it really, it took me a while to actually see that it was all about my choices.

It.

I could.

You have to stop.

And no matter how hard it is, you have to stop and you have to look at your part in it.

But you made a good point in the very beginning when we were talking about, and I say this on so many different podcasts that I'm on, is when you start looking at life as happening for you and not to you, you will make a major mind shift.

You just, you do because you learn from the things I take.

I use examples like a dui.

I mean, people are in prison for just making one bad mistake sometimes one moment of lapse of judgment.

And you, how many years do you spend beating yourself up about that and just going into this guilt.

I call it that guilt spiral, where it just keeps going and going and going.

And, you know, it's like, it's like the person that has no self esteem, they spill a glass of milk and you're like, oh, I'm so clumsy.

And then it's like, oh, I suck.

And then I'm like, I'm terrible.

And by the time it's over, you're the worst person in the world for spilling milk.

So it's like just nip it in the, you know, I, I use not.

I mean, I have a very straightforward approach too, but it's like, you know, nip it in the bud, flip it.

What did you learn from it?

And what, what are you going to do about it?

Not this woe is me and blaming someone else, because you either got to blame yourself, you got to blame somebody else.

So instead of playing that game, and.

That'S a really good statement because whenever I meet someone who blames everybody else for everything, and if I'm in an AA meeting or if I'm in a recovery experience, I know that that's the person that's going to relapse right away simply because they take no responsibility.

Right.

I don't.

If I'm not going to take responsibility for my life, then I blame everybody else.

Then everything is everybody else's fault.

So if I go back to drinking and drugging and whatever, it's not my fault.

Well, this happened.

That happened.

And, you know, I know my sponsor was killed by a drunk driver.

And I knew him, he was a lovely young man.

He was a lovely young man, but he decided he needed to drink more than, you know, to stay sober.

And now she and her husband both were Killed in that accident.

And I have a friend.

Her sister just died of drinking.

She.

And it was.

It was a.

Not a good death.

She had liver problems constantly with the water, you know, that the body, like, holds water.

She was in the hospital for a month, and then the doctor.

The doctor called my friend and said, you know, your sister's gonna die.

You need to come to the hospital right away.

Well, that was on a Tuesday, and the sister died on a.

So it was just, you know, days of misery for everybody.

And plus the time that she spent in the hospital constantly having to have this water removed from her, and it kept building and building.

And that's what happens, I guess, at the end.

So.

Yes.

And then I have another friend who was an intravenous drug user, and of course, his veins collapsed and he had all kinds of terrible problems from it.

So.

Yeah, you have to really think about your health and the future.

And do you really want to spend the rest of your life in a hospital or in a nursing home or in a facility where you have to be cared for?

Yeah.

It's time to.

It's time to get over your feelings.

And I wrote a workbook, too.

I made a workbook called Feel It, Face It, Free It.

Because a lot of times, people just can't handle their feelings.

No, yeah, I understand that completely.

I couldn't handle my feelings for a long time.

But you know what?

Once you just.

Just.

You know what?

I don't like this.

That makes me sad.

That makes me depressed.

That I hate to think about that.

Well, guess what?

If you want to move on in life and be useful to other people, feel it, face it, free it, do it.

Yeah.

You have to.

And it's.

You're right.

It is very hard because I remember the first time I went to a therapist, and I had had a horrible day, and she's like, well, how do you feel about that?

And I was like, I don't.

I was very good at not.

You know.

She's like, it doesn't make you mad?

I'm like, no.

Does it make you sad now?

I was like, nothing.

I mean, there.

When you're in the beginning stages, literally, there's that stage of just complete numb.

There are no.

Like, you don't even understand.

And that's what I tell people.

It's like, you have to.

Once you become aware, like, write it down.

Like, what does that feel like?

And then.

Oh, I mean, I don't.

I told one girl the other day, I was like, if you have to Google what is appropriate response to feeling sad because you finally voice the words, I feel sad.

And you google.

And she goes, I said, just google it.

Just for fun.

And they're like, oh, I'm supposed to cry.

I can have a temper tantrum.

I can stomp my feet, then do all those things, like, do them.

But literally, it was like she.

I mean, I know what it's like to not feel.

And, yeah, you can't.

You know, there's so many of those sayings.

You can't heal till you feel.

You can't deal till you feel.

You know, all of those things.

And you're right.

It's the very first step.

And it's that awareness is the very, you know, just becoming aware and also being aware of the responsibility part of it.

You know, I did exactly what I thought I was supposed to do.

And.

And I heard my whole life, oh, you'll never be more than this because of this and because of that and because of this.

And did I make bad choices?

Yeah, I did.

But it wasn't until I was like, oh, okay, so I'm pretty messed up that you have to take responsibility.

Sorry, my dog is barking.

Nobody else will, right?

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

So talk about.

So if you had to give somebody one tip, if you're in that, like, because you definitely have a no nonsense, no beating around the bush approach, what would be your first step for people that are like, wow, that hit home, or, you know, there's a lot of people out there listening right now that are just.

Their stomach is in a knot because they're like, how do I start?

How do I do this?

How do you start?

Okay, well, one day at a time.

You know, whatever you did yesterday, if you need to pay back money or apologize or whatever, you don't need to do that today.

You can start making a plan.

But don't worry about that today.

What can you do today to be a good person?

So let's say you yell at your kids.

Used to yell at your kids.

All right?

So today you say to yourself, you know what?

I don't care how many times so.

And so today I'm going to stay calm.

I'm going to count to 10, make a plan.

Make a plan.

It's not going to be perfect, and of course you're going to make mistakes, but start making a plan to do the right thing, to do the thing that you know will make you feel better about yourself.

So whatever that is, you need to start doing that and just worry about doing the right thing today.

Tomorrow's going to take care of itself, and so will yesterday.

I recommend aa.

I go to aa.

They have online meetings.

If you have substance abuse problems, alcohol, AA and NA for drug.

But you know what?

Just start doing something in that.

In.

In that way, in that.

Towards the direction of what you want.

And most people aren't living, you know, do you want to take guitar lessons?

Do you want to take piano?

Do you want to do some hobbies?

What are some things that you're keeping yourself from doing that you really want to do?

That?

You think I'm not good enough?

I took piano lessons at 62.

First time in my life.

You know, start doing the things that you're afraid of.

Start asking the questions.

Start asking people, like you said, go to a restaurant and ask for something that's not on the menu.

Ask them what they cook their food in.

Ask, you know, start.

Start being a little bolder.

Start making those movements.

Because guess what?

We're all growing older, and if we're lucky, we're going to have nice, long, happy lives.

But today's the day to start doing the things to improve our health, improve our mental health, improve our family lives.

Absolutely.

And like you said, do something.

Do something for you.

And if you don't know what that is, try different things.

I told, you know, I told a girl yesterday because she's like, I don't even know what I like anymore.

I don't know what I like to do.

I've been raising kids for 14 years, and I. I'm so wrapped around my child and my husband and blah, blah, blah.

I said, close your eyes and picture what the perfect day would be.

And she's like, it would be literally sitting on the beach.

I said, how far away is the beach?

She said, 40 minutes.

I said, get in your car and go.

Wow.

Just go.

So close, but so far.

But so far.

And.

And I was like, how long have you lived?

40 minutes from the beach?

And she's like, six years.

I said, how many times have you gone?

And she's like, three.

I said, well, that's gotta stop, right?

You know, like, it's so.

But if you don't, you know.

And she's like, well, I used to love arts and crafts, and now it just irritates me.

And I'm like, well, find out what.

What irritates it about, you know, what irritates you?

And she's like, I just has to be perfect.

Well, then we're gonna work on letting go of that, because what makes you happy?

Just for a few, even sometimes one to three minutes.

A day, if that's where you got to start, you know.

You know, I read, I read the Bible ten minutes a day because, you know, Bible is pretty tough.

And I'm so I set a timer.

I set a timer and I said, okay, you have to read for 10 minutes.

You can read more if you want, but never less.

Right.

And it took me a year, but I did it.

Yeah, it's like some people say, you know, I don't like to journal.

Well, just do one sentence.

Yeah, just do one sentence and then the next day try two.

And eventually before you know it, you're going to be word vomiting and have pages of stuff that you never even expected.

But just, just start just one foot forward and don't expect it to happen.

Don't expect, you know, like you said, don't expect to go from, oh, I'd really like to journal because I know that will release some of this stuff from my body and expect to, to write a novel in three weeks.

You know, just take it one day like you said, one day at a time.

And if you're listening.

And a lot of these, a lot of people, I know, a lot of the audience here is they had the parents and they didn't, you know, they didn't be turned to drugs and alcohol themselves.

There's, there's, there's a group for absolutely everything you think you're struggling with.

I, I don't even know how many, 12 step groups.

There are probably hundreds.

But there's, you know, Gamblers Anonymous and there's overeaters and there's overspenders and there's debtors and there's.

Oh my gosh, there's so many.

Like I.

You went to Al Anon.

I went to Al Anon for a long time and then it was, I needed a little bit more.

So I started with the aca, which is the adult children, you know, and that kind of, to me, just a little deeper or.

And it also, I wasn't experiencing the, the relationships at that moment.

So to me it was like, okay, let me go back a little bit, backtrack.

But there's so many different group groups and meetups.

I mean, there's guys.

If you're out there listening, find, find your tribe.

Find, find who it is.

And check out our website.

Check out my website, MarthaBurch.com there's a lot of information there that will help you.

So.

Yeah, perfect.

Perfect.

Yes, you can raise happy, responsible children.

I was just going to say the title of your book because a lot of people are Listening to this, not looking at it, but it's called yes, you can raise happy, responsible children.

So I'm going to have to check that out.

I'll put the link in your show notes of course for the episode.

But this has been super fun.

I could literally, I mean there's like so many different directions we could go with what you do and, but we don't have a day, all day obviously.

But if you could give the audience a big picture, best piece of advice or words of wisdom, what would it be?

You're worth it.

You're worth it.

So, you know, keep moving through life.

Stop.

Stop.

The world needs leaders and you have leadership qualities.

You don't have to lead in everything, but there are some, some things that, you know, you could probably lead at.

The world needs leaders, they need people.

Nursing homes are desperate.

If you're lonely, go to the nursing home and find somebody who hasn't had a visitor.

Be their friend, you know, whatever it is.

Go to the, go to the animal shelter, help the animals.

If you feel lonely, there's a place.

Stop.

Just sitting in your loneliness.

Go.

Be the friend you want others to be for you.

I felt lonely for a long time.

It never occurred to me, Martha, to be, to get a friend, you need to be a friend.

Because it was always me, me, me, me, me.

So yes, start looking at around and where look for needs to be filled that you can help in small ways.

You don't have to be perfect.

Just like Tammy said, we just need help.

People need help.

They just need somebody to listen to them sometimes.

Absolutely.

And for, you know, for your own well being and mental well being and everything else, there's nothing you can do better than serving.

If you're serving other people, your esteem, your self confidence, everything is going to go up because you're doing something that makes you happy.

And it's not, it's not ego driven, it's not about you.

It's about helping other people.

So I tell people and, and you're just the more of that positive energy you can put out in the world.

I wish everybody could just, just do one thing to make someone happy.

You know, I used to tell my kids when they were little, just watch the difference.

When you tell the lady in the grocery store that's bagging your groceries to have a blessed day.

Just watch, watch the smiles on the face.

Watch the reaction to people.

Just the tiniest little thing.

Because you never know when a comment you make or a smile you give to someone literally could save a life.

You never know Good point.

Yeah.

Right.

So.

Oh, so be that to the world and know that, like she said, know that you're worth it for sure.

Thank you so much for Martha for coming on.

Thank you.

Tammy loved it.

Really good experience.

You're a wonderful interviewer.

Well, thank you.

And I absolutely love.

I want to get your book and I want to hear more about what you do and everybody else in the Check out the show notes, go to her website.

She's got some stuff there.

Grab her book and know that you are worth it.

I think if you listen to the end of my podcast, my outro is you are way more than enough right here, right now.

So you all have a blessed day.