Understanding the Seven Different Types of ADD/ADHD with Annie Bush

Welcome to Parenting That Kid. My name is Ashley Tolliver. As a mom of twins, one being a highly sensitive child who responds to the world in a non traditional and sometimes challenging way. I understand the desire to find the golden answer. Maybe there is no golden answer. But there are resources, tips and tricks we can all use to help us make this uniquely normal parenting journey a little more fun. This podcast is a roadmap to parenting that kid for myself and other parents. If recording my journey as I seek a clear starting point, community and effort to normalize what sometimes feels abnormal, supports at least one parent, then my time is not wasted. And hey, if it doesn't, well, there's documented proof that moms deserve a glass of wine. Cheers.

On today's episode of parenting that kid, I have the pleasure of speaking with Annie Bush, a national recognized certified brain health coach under Dr. Daniel Amon, as a mom of a child with ADHD have many conversations about different types of ADHD. And traditionally, most people speak of three different types. However, there are actually seven today's guests, Annie goes into detail about each individual type of ADD, and how using three four, genetics utilizes your own DNA as your health blueprint to help you drive a lifestyle change regarding exercise, nutrition, and sleep for your optimal health. This is an exciting episode, it makes you think of the deepest part of your body, the core of it, the genetics that makes you who you are, there's not a one size fits all when it comes to helping support individuals with ADHD. But by understanding the blueprint of your body, and by understanding the multiple types of ADD, and the way that they present themselves, it gives you a little bit more of a handle on how to support the body, and not just put a bandaid over the symptoms. Thank you, Annie bush for joining me today, I am really excited that we connected because I live I mentioned to you, I have read that there are multiple types of ADHD. But that's all I've done is read about it. I haven't had a conversation. And I think there needs to be a conversation about this. I don't think everybody fits into one track with anything in the world. And so I'm really thrilled that you're here to share about those types of all different types of ADHD more than just the, I think, you know, we all have our minds focused, there's one type of ADHD and there really is multiple types out there for different people in different children, because my pockets is about children. And then I'm excited to learn how that is affects the child and how it comes about in a person. Because it's not just something that you did in your life. There's something about you. So thank you so much for joining me today.

Oh, you're welcome. Thank you for having me. And I think I think it's time to have and I think you feel it to your shoot, it's time to have a shift in the paradigm of how we talk about ATD and ADHD and all these conditions because what they are are imbalances, chemical imbalances in the brain that we can, yes, balance out. And we get caught up in the labels. And we'll talk about this more. Because there's just way too many things that are overlapping in the brain, put somebody either in this label or in that label. And so what and again, we'll talk about that later. But yes, I am Annie bush and my story, you know, because by the time you get as old as I am, you've been through a career too. And I started out in a legal track. I started out after college, legal clerk paralegal. And then I kind of jumped in my car. I grew up in Pittsburgh, and got tired of the winters, because they're just dirty and ugly and cold. And I drove out west and ended up in the National Park Service at the Grand Canyon. Oh, wow. Yeah. So after my little escape from Pittsburgh, and then I actually started working for the Department of Interior with the National Park Service, and ended up and Yosemite National Park as their prosecutor. So I got back to my legal roots out in Yosemite, and I was a prosecutor out there for almost 10 years as a paralegal specialists little niche in the federal government. And then I then moved back with my dad husband and went to law school at the age of 40. Because then I could either have been the oldest living paralegal or actually went to law school. So already I go to law school, and then I become an assistant state attorney down here in state of Florida. Now, why is that important to this discussion, because we look at our skill sets that we develop through life, and the skill set that you develop while you're in law school, as you read a lot. You have to absorb a lot and you have to learn how to apply what you read. You know, those are the three main skill sets you get when you're and law school. So having those skill sets carry with you throughout your lifetime. So I'm an assistant state attorney, and then my parents get sick. Our dad gets cancer and he passes away. And then my mother gets cancer. And most of us in the health and wellness space get here because of either the health of ourselves or health of a family member. And I saw, like, I used to take my mom to her chemo treatments, and saw how the traditional medical industry was treating her or not treating her I was taking her over to get her chemo. And there were baskets of candy, and cookie, and cupcakes right there where they were given the chemo, and I'm like, wait a minute, I am just getting into this health and wellness thing. I've read enough to know that cancer feeds off of sugar and makes it worse, you basically fuel cancer by doing a sugar. And here you're giving my mother chemo to kill the cancer and giving her sugar at the same time. I was confused. And then I got frustrated. And then I got angry. And that I decided to do something about it. And that's when I switched over into the health and wellness space started out as a personal trainer, you know, and then we do what we do we expand into different certifications and health coaching. And then I stumbled into brain health. And that was a total game changer for me because I got into it. Because my personal training clients were coming to me telling me stories about their parents, or their grandparents that were in memory care units, and we're talking about Alzheimer's and Parkinson's and dementia. And I was and then I you know I was having a little flashback to my mom going you know what, there's something that we need to be able to do. So I dove into Dr. Daniel Amon certification course. And lo and behold, one of the things that he really specializes in is ADD and ADHD. So here I am actually sitting here reading my course material going, Oh, this is me. This is me. Yeah. Wait. So you know, my interest, then became a little more personal. As I then took the deep dive into the different categories of ADD, which ADHD is one of seven different forms of ADD.

Wow, seven. So the brain is his is his expertise. And I've read one of his books and I have seen a lot of the scans the comparisons and I'm a visual learner. So I love that I love that I can look it up healthy. And I say healthy brain and then non healthy brain. And seven, he really does dive into those different ones where traditionally how many do people normally if you wouldn't know about Dr. Ayman, how many people normally think there is about ADHD, one, two,

I just got it in a very active Facebook conversation that I exited out of because five just put just came out and it was 303. Okay, which you know, so the, the other people in the other four categories sorry for you. So the best way to understand it is alright, all your listeners out there, put your hand on your forehead. That is your prefrontal cortex, I'm going to keep this very simple. That's where your prefrontal cortex is. That's where your focus, that's where your attention is. That's where your working memory is. And, and I'm not going to use the word normal, but you guys know what I'm talking about. With a normal brain. When you start to focus on something, blood flow goes to your prefrontal cortex, right? You start focusing, you start paying attention, and the blood flows up there. With add, when you try to focus the blood drains from there. There is a decreased blood flow to the prefrontal cortex when you try to activate it. And Dr. Daniel Amon uses the term the prefrontal cortex drops. Okay. So that's why when you have a child who's trying to study and do their homework, the harder they try, the worse it gets. Because the more that prefrontal cortex drops, now, that prefrontal cortex is also in charge of keeping the rest of the brain in check. It's sort of like the CEO and all the different parts of your brain are different departments. And when the CEO goes on vacation, or the prefrontal cortex drops, that the other parts of the brain get overactive. And that's how these seven categories come into play as to which part of the brain gets overactive. Wow, wow, okay. So that's why with some of them, there's more of an emotional component. Some of them there's more of the hyperactive component. I'm an over focused on those of you that can relate to this, I get a hold of something the world could stop. I will not get distracted by anything. But the bills don't get paid the emails don't get responded to, you know, nothing else happens. Yeah. So some of your best CEOs and presidents of companies are over focus, because they're really good at what they do. But they need to have a full bunch of really good other people with them to get all this other stuff done.

And oh, focus is traditionally on what they are loving, right? Isn't it kind of like you're getting this dopamine fix or this natural Hi, this good feeling. So that's why you're going to focus because you've connected to that area where the other paying bills is not usually enjoyable. And so you're

exactly if it if it's not giving me that really super high dopamine bump, it's not getting done. So what once I realized that the adjustments and there's some nutrients, there's nutrients, there's vitamins, there's settlements, there's food, there's exercise, there's all these natural ways to reduce the symptoms. And for me, now, I know, every morning, I need to do the most boring thing first, or else it won't get done. It's almost like the thing that I want to do becomes dessert. That's a good way of looking at it. Okay. Right. And then also with over focus, then we have to switch from dopamine to serotonin in the evening, to take the edge off the dopamine. So with all these different types of ADD, you're gonna be combining dopamine, serotonin, GABA CME to balance out those neurotransmitters.

And it's such a tool to empower yourself with that it's, it's a learning process to figure out what what that is to bring in that serotonin because you could stay there that dopamine all day long, do I not sleep and not sleep? Exactly. And I have one of those to just 10 o'clock, 11 o'clock. What are you doing? Can you share the other types? So you've kind of talked about this one, but there's seven. So can you continue on so I can?

Yeah, absolutely. So the first type we're going to say is the ADHD which has the hyperactive component. These folks it's a low cerebellum. So there's movement all the time. And we're talking to children and adults. Right? Because if you don't get diagnosed as a child, you just carry this through to adulthood. fidgety, you're restless, you have difficulty waiting your turn. So you can see these people in the grocery line. Right? They're talking incessantly. There's always noise, there's always activity. The second type is the inattentive. These are usually two. So the first type, everybody knows who you are. Right? Because you noisy you're fidgety, you're, you're moving. The second type is inattentive. And this is the type that gets slipped through all the time. Because these are these folks are quiet. Okay. They're, they're told they like daydream a lot. They're not motivated. They seem to be slow. This is your child, and you're gonna say is slow and lazy, and they're bored and they're apathetic. And they're not motivated. They're spacey, they're preoccupied. It's just they can't focus. There's nothing that's given them that dopamine bump. And this is mostly girls. And this was, um, Dr. Daniel Amon, his daughter. Okay, she was the quiet girl. She always behaved, right? There was no disciplinary things, but she just couldn't do her homework. And he realized that yeah, this is what was going on with his daughter. So it for all your parents out there, you have a quiet child that can't do our homework or his homework. This is we're gonna look at all right, that the third type is over focus. That's me. We have difficulty identifying options. Once we get, you know, one train of thought we're staying there. Just stay in our lane all the time. So we get a little stubborn. Okay. The fourth type is temporal low. All right. So this is where the other types are going to come in. This is where somebody's very quick to anger. They're going to go from zero to 100. At the drop of a hat. They have periods of panic and fear. So it's this is more of where the emotions start coming in, because that's what happens with your temporal lobes. They're very sensitive. They I have like a mild paranoia. And then this is where like physical conditions start coming in like headaches, you know, a whole bunch of digestive issues, not necessarily well sometimes like dark thoughts and suicidal thoughts. So you're going to have this emotional component along with the add. So that's what these types are adding to, we have our basic add symptoms. But then we have these other parts of the brain again, jumping in, and the temporal lobes is that's where all those emotions are. Then the next one is limbic, which is another emotional center. This is but this is going to be like depression, and negativity and low energy, these people are going to be the ones that isolate the don't call you that don't return your phone calls Leave me alone, they have perceived helplessness. Okay, yeah. And they lose interest and things, they have sleep issues, like chronic low self esteem kind of stuff. So these are the really low folks. Yeah, you know, they're not, they're not going to reach out for help, you know, they're just going to be there. And then totally opposite, that is the next category, which is called Ring of Fire. And it's when every part of the brain is in hyper active mode. Okay? These people are going to be sort of, like, confused with or compared to people that are bipolar, they're going to have that high Manix. And then the really low lows, they're going to be unpredictable. You know, they're going to be have like, grandiose, bigger than life kind of thoughts. And the next thing, you know, they're going to be down in the dumps, they're gonna go to those extremes. So those are the ring of fire people, and it's gonna be very cyclic. So didn't go much, very much like bipolar, that they're gonna have the Maddox and then the loads. And then the last one is anxious folks. Anxious add. So this is these people, they predict the worst or the worst, you know, your people and just worry about everything. These are the people that should not be watching the news. Do

they avoid conflict? They're gonna predict the worse, you have the fear of being judged. They're very, very, very sensitive. Wow, this is all over the place. Right? And you can add that hyperactive component of the ADHD to any one of these. Yes. And then, let's just top it off with I also do genetic testing. Yeah, I'm a, I'm certified through three export genetics. And we come into this world with a blueprint. Right? Ai, that's what our DNA is, AI, there are certain genetic snips. Those are their innate variations on the genes. We have two genes, we get one from our father and one from our mother's side. And they come together, and we have like 25,000 of them. And we're all the same 99.9% At that point, 1% of the difference is what makes us each different. And some of these genetic snips. So let's the most common, I hate to use the word treatment for ADHD stimulants. Right? Right, right? Well, there are some genetic snips that make you less able to respond to some stimulants. So let's just say you have a child or a young teenager or as an adult, and you start dosing them, and they're not responding. And then you just keep dosing them at higher doses when they're not able to respond. Right, not knowing that there's some bad, there's days that you need to make an enzyme to make dopamine, your body's not able to make that enzyme, that precursor enzyme that will then convert it to government. Some people they have dopamine levels that have too high. Right, some other people that they don't have as many receptors, so you can try bumping up all the dopamine, but they just don't have as many receptors there to accept that over me. Yeah. And then there's another gene that's really interesting. It's Mao A, that actually degrades the dopamine. So Wow. Yeah, I've you know, I'm of the philosophy right now, the more I get into this genetics that you should come out of the hospital with your baby, your birth certificate and your DNA because it's not going to change write it as who you are. Right? And then you'll know as a parent, as a parent, why you shouldn't be giving them off hearts.

It's interesting you say that. So we had my daughter tested for I can't remember three, four years ago, and it was her dopamine was low, and that we, if she were ever to be medicated Ritalin would not work for her genetically. And I, I've heard parents struggle saying, Well, we're upping the dose or upping the dose, and I always wonder, Have you have you done a real test on the child to see if it's even worth it? Because upping the dose has no benefit if your child cannot take that medicine, and then we give their kids caffeine because they found that that actually worked better than all of these meds they had tried. It's all it boils down to your genetic component of your body.

Right? And again, it's funny that you mentioned caffeine because there is a genetic snip. That will tell you either you are a slow metabolizer or a fast metabolizer of caffeine. Oh, yes, I'm a very fast metabolizer. So I'm one of those people that could have coffee after dinner, and it wouldn't keep me up at night. Okay, last, the last results that I got are this gentleman that I'm gonna have to read it to him. He's a very slow metabolizer of caffeine, but he's having trouble sleeping too. So it's like, Okay, here's, here's the reason.

Yeah. So these genetic snips, do they correlate with each type of ADD is there doesn't seem to be that if you are, let's say a hyper Acura hyperfocus, that your genetic genetic snip will look similar to a lot of other people who are like that,

or a there's, there's the one thing that is just amazing about what 3x Four guys is, they there's like 36 different pathways, they take those pathways narrowed down to six categories. And you have to look at the synergy between the snips. Okay, well, we do not do and that's the other paradigm shift that's happening in genetics is we got to quit looking at one snip and making it the villain. You know, these variations that make up who we are, you know, there are not good genes and bad genes, there aren't fat genes and smart genes, right. And they're all just variations of who make us who we are. So you have to look at even these genetic snips that would apply to ADD or ADHD as they would operate in synergy with other snips. Okay, interesting, because there are certain foods and the reason why I say this is there are certain foods that help boost dopamine.

Can you give an example a couple examples of that?

Protein, but let's just take any. So for me, I need to have my biggest protein meal, midday. Hmm. So if you had a child that has ADD, you would give them protein for breakfast, before you send them off to school.

Yeah. And then if the body in that would have to have the receptors that hold on to those, that dopamine, I mean, you mentioned that, like, if you don't even have the receptors, you can do all the protein you want. And it's just not going to do any good for your body.

Right. So you would have to find another workaround, you would have to supplement. And some of the dopamine is like our car, Rosie is a perfect example, that you would have to up your L tyrosine. If you weren't able to metabolize dopamine from your proteins interest and like pumpkin seeds, I pumpkin seeds, like all day long. Yeah. So I so know, the way as a as a brain health coach, what I would do with someone is I have questionnaires, you would fill out the questionnaires. And from there, then I could tell you what your primary category is. Usually there's some overlap. Okay. Okay. So I can tell you what category you're in. And then from there, say, okay, these are the foods that you should have during the day and these are the foods you should have in the evening. If you want to take supplements. These are the ones you should take during the day. These are the ones you should take during the evening. When is the best time for you to exercise? Hmm, you know, if your child comes home from school, and you're going to try to sit them down and make make them do homework. Forget it. Tell them to go ride their bike first. Yeah, yeah, yeah, right. Right. So um, you know, little things like that, but until you know what your prior category is, you know, I had I had a client that her daughter had come home from law school. So she came home for Thanksgiving break, and she couldn't Get off the couch. She was crying. She was sobbing. The mother didn't know what to do. She goes, Can I send her over to see you? And I'm like, Absolutely. Here. She had gone to a doctor and told her she was stressed out because law school and they put her on an SSRI that was taking her down too low. I gave her like three days worth of nutrients to raise up her dopamine. By day two, she was a different person. Oh, oh, wow. Right, we just needed to balance her out. So until you know where you fit, it's like that it's fun little puzzle pieces together. But knowing when to dose with the dopamine, when to dose with the serotonin, maybe you need some GABA to shut down the voice ahead. Right? We need GABA, he just calm down. So that's what I do as a brand health coach is helped to make you know these distinctions. And then just start tweaking.

Yeah, it's so logical when you start talking it through. I mean, you have use that with everything in your life, you have to more of this less of this, switch this around. And we don't really think about that with our own bodies. It's the doctor gave me this, and this is what I need to do. And you could not be with a

doctor was somehow able to see through your skin into your brain. And you could send it you had looked at some of Dr. Daniel Amon scans. Yeah. So the one of his sayings is, you don't know until you look. It's very true. Right? So that's, we're applying the genetics, because that is never going to change.

I love that. So can I ask a question, then? Is this something you see in family a trend and family member people? So when you have one person come to you, and you've figured this out? Do you start seeing them go? Oh, could you we need to get my mother in here, we need to get my dad like, this really is a genetic component within the genealogy line of an individual?

Yes, yes. And that was the one thing that Dr. Ayman had to realize. This happened with his daughter.

And do you notice the different or same within the seven categories? Do they go, Oh, this is for you. This is for you? Or does it tend to be the same trend? And this family?

That's all different? Because again, you know, it's that interplay with all the other games? Yeah.

Okay. So cool. So cool. So what does it look like coming to work with you? Could you describe in a quick overview of, you know, somebody walks in and says, I would like to work with you, how does that go? What's your process?

That process would be I would use specifically with an add ADHD, I would send you an initial assessment, what their typical questions, what are your goals, your family history, medical history, and then I would send you these questionnaires, you would fill them out, send them back to me, I would go through go through the analysis, we would get together and go over the results. And then decide, you know, if you wanted to work with me for a month, or three months or six months, some people, you know, you can tell them what to do, and they're on it. Other people were like, You know what, I need to take this step by step. So I'm here for as much or as as little guidance as you need for me. But I think the first step is determining what category you fit into your primary, your secondary. And if you're, I would really advise people to get their genetic stone.

Is that part of this with you? Is there is there a possibility to add that so that you can really see that? Yeah,

absolutely. And how that works is the kit and it's just cheek swab. Easy? Yeah. The kit gets sent to you, you do this swab, you send it in, and like three weeks, I get the report, I do my analysis of it. I meet with a senior member 3x Four, they go over my analysis to make sure I haven't missed anything. Wow. And they're always updating the databases to make sure it's the most up to date. And then I get on a zoom with you and we go over your results and you get your report and then it's the same process some people are good to go. Other people are like well, I'll I can do this change but can I work with you for a month or three months or six months? Wow. Yeah, but 3x Four report is going to tell you what your body was designed to eat, how your body was designed to exercise how your body was designed to process things like caffeine, and iron and B 12 and folate and vitamin D. Which are those all you know, specifically vitamin D and it's really B 12. Really that plays a lot in with AD D and ADHD.

I've heard that that's new to me. And something that I'm starting to research more I know a lot about dopamine. But I, I've heard that recently that the those two are just key components that we need to be looking at as well.

Yeah, because we're also talking about your nerve firings. Mm hmm. Especially when we're getting into the the anxious types, you know, we got to be able to settle those those nerves down.

Right, not literally living in fight or flight all the time.

Exactly. Exactly.

So do you have some resources that people can look up now places? How do they contact you and find these resources? I always like my parents, most appearance listeners to have something they can look up now and start implementing or doing a little bit of research and figuring out what their next step is.

They can go to a finally getting my revamping my website. It's www dot your total body dot c? Oh, oh okay.com. It's just.co. And there's a brand Health tab on there, you can click on that it will take you to the brain and D website. Okay, and he's got tons of information on there and his blog, Dr. Daniel Amon is really, he's so giving with his with his information, and you can just go into his blog, and just put ADHD and as a search term or add, and you'll get his most recent information as far as what he's doing with those two.

Perfect, how about you? So you have a podcast, as well? Do you mind sharing a little bit about that? So people can

Yeah, I have a podcast called Loving longevity. It's every Friday afternoon at 3pm. Eastern on USA, Global TV and radio, on YouTube. And it's, you know, it is a combination of everything that I've learned from the last 10 years, because I've had my company for 10 years, I've had a wellness center that had a salt room in it and infrared sauna, and, you know, photo bio modulation and I was doing full body vibration before ever anybody knew who it was, wow. So I've taken all of that and put it under the umbrella of longevity. Because getting is healthy, getting optimal health today will keep us an optimal health for all of our tomorrow's. So we can shift again, another paradigm shift in the way we think about our lives in terms of longevity and not mortality. You know, let's plan on living to be 100 or 102.

I love that. Start today. Yeah.

And if somebody just wants to get in contact with me, and you know, and just chat about any anything that we've talked about the easiest way is just to email me at at your total body@yahoo.com at yahoo.com. Yeah, your total body@yahoo.com.

Do you have any book recommendations? I'm a I'm a reader of multiple books on my nightstand and I'll pick it up, put it down. I know Dr. Amon has some great books. Do you have any book recommendations that people can do some more?

His guests specifically, I'm looking over at my bookshelf right now. He has one specifically with ADD. And that's where I would start out it's called Healing, add, Healing ADD. It's Healing ADD I would start there. Okay. Because he's gonna he goes through all these types.

It's very detailed so people can start. Yes. And then you read it over and over

and over again. Yeah.

Okay. Wonderful. Well, Annie, thank you so much. This, this always gets me so excited. And then I go off and research a whole bunch because I just, I love that there are people out you who are up there like you who are looking at the whole picture, and not just one area and then trying to put a bandaid on it. Because that's,

that's it. And we really need to go upstream to get to the root causes and not be so niche oriented. You know, I have some people that send me these like micro nutrient test results. I'm like, Okay, can we put that aside for now? Let's go a little upstream.

Yeah, well, and we are as anything in our life, we have to look at the whole picture. It's not just one thing. There's not just one single answer for the whole entire world.

Right? And it may be something very simple, like your nutrition, the foods you eat, how much exercise are you getting? How much water do you drink and how much quality sleep are you getting?

It all sounds so easy. And then

you know and once you know the answers, then it it you know, the simplicity of it. Sometimes we overthink it. We you know we think it can't be that simple. Well, yeah, once you know what to do then yes, it is that simple.

Well Thank you, Annie, so much for joining me today. Such a wonderful conversation.

Thank you, Ashley.